Users mailing list

[Hans de Goede]

Hi All,

On 3-Jun-25 4:02 PM, Laurent Pinchart wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> We've discussed this topic today. A few options are on the table, each
> with pros and cons. I'll try to summarize them here.
> 
> 1. Keep using the libcamera-devel mailing list
> 
>    Pros:
>      - Easy to set up, as there's nothing to do.
>      - Large number of subscribers, so likely to contain the knowledge
>        required to answer user questions.
>    Cons:
>      - The -devel name implies this isn't for users, so it could create
>        a psychological barrier.
>      - High(ish) volume, can put off some users.
>      - A large number of user questions could disturb the
>        development-related discussions.
>      - Difficult to reply to an old e-mail from before you subscribe to
>        the list.
>      - Apparently some people consider that mailing lists should be a
>        thing from the past. I have no idea who those people are :-)
> 
> 2. Create a libcamera-users mailing list
> 
>    Pros:
>      - Easy to set up, infrastructure to manage mailing lists already
>        exists for libcamera.org.
>      - The list name reflects its purpose.
>      - No risk of flooding the devel list with user questions.
>    Cons:
>      - There would be less developers subcribed to the list, so lower
>        chances of getting answers until a wider pool of knowledgeable
>        users appears.
>      - Difficult to reply to an old e-mail from before you subscribe to
>        the list.
>      - Apparently people didn't get my point from 1., and still consider
>        that mailing lists are a thing from the past.
> 
> 3. Use gitlab.freedesktop.org issues
> 
>    Pros:
>      - Easy to set up, gitlab is already there.
>      - The people who disagreed with me in 1. and 2. will be happy about
>        a non-mailing-list solution.
>      - No risk of flooding the devel list with user questions.
>      - Easy to reply to old messages.
>    Cons:
>      - There would likely be even less people watching issues, so even
>        less relevant answers (I may be biased on this though).
>      - We plan to possibly switch from bugzilla (on bugs.libcamera.org)
>        to gitlab, user questions would therefore disturb bug processing.
>      - gitlab issues are not a forum, the tool seems ill-fitted for the
>        purpose.
>      - Requires registering a gitlab.freedesktop.org account and getting
>        it approved, which isn't an immediate process due to spam issues.
> 
> 4. Create a libcamera forum
> 
>    Pros:
>      - The people who dislike mailing lists may like this (unless we
>        decide to use phpbb I suppose).
>      - No risk of flooding the devel list with user questions.
>      - Easy to reply to old messages.
>    Cons:
>      - More work to install and maintain.
>      - There would likely be even less people watching issues, so even
>        less relevant answers until a sizeable community forms.
>      - Requires registering an account and logging in (I'm also biased
>        here).
>      - For people who prefer e-mail workflows, forums are disturbing.

I just want to add my 2 cents to the forum bits here as someone who
also has a preference for mailinglists over forums.

A while back my local hackerspace moved from having a mailinglist to
a forum, specifically to discourse. For similar reasons, it seems that
the youth and thus the future does not like/do mailinglists and want
a forum instead.

The hackerspace specifically chose discourse because this has pretty
decent email integration when mailinglist mode is enabled.

Every topic becomes an email thread with every new comment in the topic
becoming a reply in the thread. And as long as your from: matches the 
email used to "subscribe" to the forum you can also reply by email.
So basically if you want everything can be done from your email client,
just as with a list.

In my experience this work well, at least good enough that I'm not
bothered by the move to discourse and as you say moving to a forum
is probably best in the long run.

That still leaves the issue of needing to have someone to actually
set up and admin a discource based libcamera forum though, without
someone to work on this I agree that sticking with just the -devel
maillist is best.

Regards,

Hans